real parameter estimate problem w/different interval lengths

questions concerning analysis/theory using program MARK

real parameter estimate problem w/different interval lengths

Postby heidizie » Fri Jul 30, 2010 6:12 pm

Hello!

I am having a problem with my real parameter estimates. They are not coming out as I would expect based on my design matrix. I am using a multi-state live and dead recovery model. I have 3 states and 4 attribute groups.

I think the problem stems from the fact that my 4 groups have different interval lengths. I dealt with this by including a column in the design matrix with the number of days that corresponds to each interval for each group (repeating for each stage) and using the log link with survival as was recommended:

Re: [ http://www.phidot.org ] groups with varying intervals
by Jon Runge » Wed Apr 25, 2007 9:30 am
I asked Gary White the same question awhile back, here's response:

"You will have to include the time interval between occasions (call it L) as a covariate in a log link for the parameter. So, assume you are estimating survival, S, across an interval of length L. Then, log(S)=B1*L, and S=exp(B1*L)=exp(B1)^L. So, the unit length of survival (day) is exp(B1), and the interval survival is exp(B1)^L = DSR^L where DSR = Daily Survival Rate."

Just to be complete (ie risk stating the obvious): You model the time interval covariate with a column for L in the design matrix. Then you need to have rows specific to each group and time period to capture the unique interval for each group/time combination. Also, make sure that phi has a log link. Don't constrain any parameters with log link to be 0--that won't work. Finally, note that DSR is just an example. You could use unit length = 1 week, 1 month, whatever you want your survival estimate to mean biologically.
--Jon
Jon Runge


The models run, but when I look at the real parameter estimates, they are not as I expect. For example, when I run a model with phi(group), I expect to see every survival estimate for each interval within a group to be the same number. This is not the case. Estimates that correspond to intervals with the same length (within a group) result in the same number, but otherwise they are different. Being in the same group is not enough even though that is how I have the design matrix set up. I believe I have my matrix set up correctly as far as which parameters belong to which grouping.

When I delete my column with my interval length information, everything works out correctly. All estimates for a given group end up being the same, as I expect. However, I can't just leave that column out because I believe including the interval length is crucial to getting better estimates. Perhaps I am missing something obvious, but I would really appreciate any help I can get. Thank you very much.

Heidi
heidizie
 
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Joined: Fri Jul 30, 2010 3:29 pm

Re: real parameter estimate problem w/different interval len

Postby heidizie » Wed Aug 04, 2010 3:53 pm

Hello again---
I just wanted to let you all know that this problem has been resolved. The real parameter estimates should not be the "same" when different days are involved. The real parm estimates are the survival probabilities during that interval and take into account the number of days, but are not reported as a daily survival probability. Instead, I have incorporated an effect of interval length in the form of a beta parameter. The beta parameter estimate for day length is the same for all of the corresponding real parameter estimates (assuming the effect of days is set to be constant across groups, etc.) and one must also include the relevant beta parameters from any intercepts, groups, etc when doing calculations. The betas are what are the "same" or "different".

I apologize if this should have been obvious, but I became confused about how interval length was incorporated based on some old notes I had and also a bit of misunderstanding. I thought I should post the answer in case anyone has a similar problem in the future.
Thank you,
Heidi
heidizie
 
Posts: 3
Joined: Fri Jul 30, 2010 3:29 pm


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